[Transcript starts at 1:12]
Hello, hello, hello my podcast people and thank you for joining me for yet another episode of my favorite podcast. Today we are talking about something that is near and dear to my heart, transitioning away from patient care. Full disclosure, I don't even know if I wanna say full disclosure, but I'm gonna throw it out there first and foremost: I did an entire episode about my story, my journey, uh, my career. I did it about three years ago, but the important stuff is still there. So if you wanna check out that episode, that's episode 231. Uh, it was from July 23rd, 2020. So maybe I need an update on that. But either way, go check that episode out if you're wanting to hear my story.
The reason that this comes up is cuz I was in the DMs and you know, I get a lot of my podcast episodes from, uh, podcast episode ideas from you folks and someone slid into the DMs and was like, Hey, I was listening to, um, a past episode or listening to an episode, could you steer me in the right direction? I'm not sure which one it was. Maybe you were on someone else's. Cuz y'all know I talk a lot. Uh, and this person is a PT. They are getting their, um, maybe an OCS, something like that. And they were like, I am ready to fucking just be done with everything. And I was like, I got you.
Uh, so that's episode 231. Also of note, if you're ever looking to search through the podcast, because I have 400 plus episodes, we're we're closing in on 500. I know you ain't gonna scroll back. If you go to the website and then you go to podcasts, you can use the search bar. You can use a search bar from any point on the website.
But if you go to the podcast section, um, in particular, you can use a search bar in there. There's a search field. Um, my guy, Joe, we had to him move it to the top of the page and you can put in whatever keyword- keyword can be more than one word by the way, folks, I learned that from Lex. Um, you can put in whatever you're, you are looking to learn about, and any episodes that I have done relevant or related to that topic will come up so, just as an aside, of note, the podcast is searchable.
So today's episode, let's hop into this thing. We are talking about transitioning away from patient care and real talk I don't, I don't want this episode to be something for new grads. I think that there's a lot of new grads in this space, a lot of new grad physical therapists that are jaded. They're not even actually new grads, people that are in school and they're already like, I don't wanna treat and like I'm not gonna make any money.
And I'm like, I get it. There are limitations to the profession and there are some things to overcome. But if you're already in it, you're, you're a new grad, stick with it. Like let's push through instead of just listening to, you know, all the curmudgeons and people that have been burned. Um, and maybe I'll do an episode about that as well, just the reality of a PT school. Cause it's not for everyone and there is a significant financial burden, um, that can come along with it. But I don't want this episode to serve as discouragement to not go and treat right. Go do the thing. There are people out there who love treating. It exists. On top of mind is my guy Adam Wolf.
I think he will treat for the rest of his life. He teaches as well. But dude loves to treat and I need you to know that, that it does exist. Uh, and treating for the rest of your life, the rest of your life, quote unquote, however long you're gonna be treating, is a possibility. It's not like everyone burns out or everyone stops or anything like that.
Or you have to stop. Like, it's possible, and I want to put that into the ether. Especially if any of you listening to this are, um, going to PT school, you're in PT school, you're a new grad, you're whatever. I just wanna make sure that all sides get represented here.
Longevity within your career and actually treating can absolutely be extended by learning more efficient and effective ways to treat. And I'm gonna use this opportunity to plug my girl Anna Hartman. She's Movement Rev on Instagram. If I was still treating, I'd be going and learning all of her stuff. Uh, she takes kind of like a neuro visceral approach. She blends osteopathic medicine, um, and orthopedic, and an orthopedic approach. And it makes sense.
It's not, I, I like to say that she makes the woo, wow. Um, it is all science and I kind of feel that woo is used in a pejorative way, and I'm not using it that way, but, either way, if you're looking for a more efficient, a more effective way to treat people, you're not looking at, you don't, you don't, you're, you're not, you're ready to step away from that, like super aggressive, uh, super purely biomechanical approach where it's like, you know, pounding on people and, and if you're small like me, you're a smaller person like me, that's, that's not sustainable.
Um, that is gonna be my girl Anna Hartman. But, back to transitioning away from clinical care and patient care. I personally never liked treating, uh, but I did it for eight years and it wasn't like I did it begrudgingly for eight years. I kind of threw that number in there so that, again, if you're listening to this and you're a new grad, like give it time, friends, give it time.
Uh, I did it for eight years and I'm glad that I did it. Uh, I think that I built a tremendous safety net with it, and that's part of the reason I went to PT school was knowing that I'd always have a job, I'd always have a career, I'd always have something to fall back on, you know, push come to shove. And I, I built my career on it.
I built my, my career on the things that I learned from treating and my success with treatment, with treatment. And you know, that's what I started off with was treating and then teaching about treating. And now, yes, I do business coaching for people who treat, and you see the evolution there, but, my journey has largely been one of excluding things.
And one of the first things that I excluded was, was clinical cla, was was clinical care, was the, the treatment side of things. And so I personally have never liked treatment. I love the assessment side of things. I don't love holding people's hands through things. And even now with online business stuff, I really enjoy problem solving.
I really enjoy identifying, you know, what, what needs to be solved, the order of operations for things. I don't love, and I will not mi, I will not. I almost said manufacture. That's not right. I will not micromanage people. Um, I like to work with people who are independent adults. Uh, I don't love the super duper really tight handholding of things.
I enjoy guiding people. Um, but there is a difference between that and just like, literally holding someone's hand and like walking them through every single step. That to me is not as fun. And it wasn't as fun, it wasn't fun with, with PT. I didn't like that people like, I'm like fucking counting your reps here and like making sure that you do these things.
Like you wanna get better, go do those things. If you wanna know how to do it, amazing. But like, if you need me there in order to do it, I don't really love that. Right. It's gotta be on you.
So as we're thinking about. Got something in my eye. As we're thinking about transitioning away from clinical care, the thing, the biggest thing that I want everyone to be thinking about is giving themselves time to make that transition.
Especially if finances are a concern. If you're like independently wealthy or you like saved a ton of money and you're fine, then it's not as big of a deal. But if you don't have this huge cushion, which is part of the reason that I took those, that you know that super long time and I treated for eight years cuz I was building financial, you know, safety and, um, knowledge and wherewithal and putting things in place. Looking, you know, being like, oh, I'm just gonna start another business, or I'm gonna start a business, that takes time for that to actually be financially successful and for financially profitable. How much time? Give yourself a minimum of three to five years to make that transition, to start this thing for it to be viable.
So if that's the case, then we have to understand going into this, going into this feeling, this idea, this, this decision of, I wanna transition away from pa, from patient care. I love it. But let's, for that, let's make sure that we're giving it time to actually make, giving ourselves time to actually make that transition.
Of note, just jumping into the online space, that is not an immediate solution and it will not work out immediately. Right. It's not, will not work out quickly. Building something in the online space, I talk about this all the time, it takes time. So that, that ties back into the last point that I just said of giving this thing the space that it needs to to, that it needs in order to grow. If you're like, Hey, I wanna start my own thing, I wanna start my own business. Amazing. I love that for you. I fucking love that for you. But if you're like, Hey, I want to go online, cool. Then understand that it's not just like, I'm gonna quit this job and then all of a sudden I'm just gonna be amazing online.
Quick plug here. For those of you that are in the in-person space, you have a brick and mortar clinic, physical therapist, chiropractor, something like that. And you are thinking about making this transition into the online space and you're like, Hey, I wanna build an audience. Or maybe you already have a bit of an audience, you're like, I wanna sell to them.
Um, largely kind of going in this B to C business to consume, excuse me, B to B approach, but it can be done B to C as well. Either way, if you're looking to go from in-person to online and you want help doing that, my girl, Lex Lancaster, I brought her on before, talk about it all the time. We are teaming up to launch a new group program, group, group coaching program in the fall.
Um, we are fleshing it out right now, um, but the basic concept that's gonna be marketing and audience building meets tech and implementation. We work together with a lot of clients. We work, we work with the same clients, but separately. And it's just, you know, at a point where we're like, we should probably just do this together and offer a service and a group program where people can be doing learning from each other, learning together.
Um, we can be helping those folks together. So if you're interested in this, again, we have more details coming once we sit and, and flesh it out a bit more, I'm not gonna lie and be like it's all done and we're ready to go. Um, this is something we talked about, about a few months ago and it's like, yeah, let's, this makes sense.
The idea is still there. We still wanna do it. Uh, so we are gonna do that this fall. If you're interested in that and you wanna add your name to the interest list so you're the first to hear about it, cuz it will be limited spots just cuz you can't help a million people, right? We have quality, uh, ensuring quality by reducing quantity there.
So if you want interested in that, we will drop the interest list in the show notes. Thank you, Courtney.
So back to this transitioning away from clinical care. I trust, I believe that you know yourself. I do. But I also believe that we as humans are not the best at identifying the actual and specific cause of our feelings.
Oftentimes, if we're upset, it can be something else that's upsetting us, but then we take it out on this other thing or we think that it's this other thing. So as it relates to this example, this idea of, of, you know, transitioning away from, from clinical care and transitioning away from patient care, a bad workplace can easily become, I hate this profession.
Seeing really shitty clients can very easily become, I hate being a physical therapist. So what, as we move forward with the, the action items here, I'm going to start suggesting or suggest ways that you really identify what is the contributor, the main contributing factor to those feelings. And then we look to get rid of those, those things as a start.
Next point here is that, especially if you're a physical therapist, I can speak directly to you cuz that's my, that's my history there, no time has been wasted. I think that we, we pay so much, schooling is long, and people are like, I don't wanna walk away from this because I don't want it to have all been for nothing.
And it's not. It never will be. I really want you to internalize the fact that all of these skills that you gained during your clinical career and the connections you made during your time at, you know, treating as a clinician, they will absolutely carry over into whatever it's you do next.
I'm thinking about Alyson actually right now. Um, Alyson ever, Alyson Evans, my mentor. I brought her on a few times as well. I brought her on maybe once or once, at least once. Um, we talked about Fringe, maybe twice. Um, if you could link those. Thank you, Courtney. Um, but. She is now the founder of a company called Fringe, the, uh, manufacturer CBD products and red lights.
I did a whole thing about that. That came from her start as a chiropractor, right? I met her through Rock Tape. She was one of the big names, one of the higher ups at Rock Tape. And again, that job as well stemmed from her initial career as a treating chiropractor. So I do not want any of you, I'm gonna encourage all of you rather, to realize that there's no time has been wasted, no such thing as wasted time.
You have gained skills, you've gained experiences, you've built, uh, networks, you've created connections during that time, and these things can absolutely help you as you move forward. That in mind, I have a phenomenal resource for you if you're considering leaving the clinical side, but you think maybe you wanna stay involved in healthcare, or you wanna take these skills that you know you have and you know, use 'em in another way.
And that's gonna be The Non-Clinical PT. This is a site, we'll call it that, a resource, that's run by my girl, Meredith Castin. She is just a total just gem. I love this woman. She's phenomenal. The website is the nonclinical pt.com. We'll link that for you as well. And there's just like so much information on there.
There's job listings on there as well. There's just, um, like quizzes and things to kinda figure out how you can best use your skillset. There's a ton of resources for you to, to check out to get you started on that path and open your eyes to things that I have no idea that even exist. Like I am very much am nonclinical, but it's more of like the creator route.
We're going into social media and things like that. That doesn't have to be at all what you do. It can be that you go into like more of the, I don't wanna say admin side, but, suffice to say there are plenty of jobs that you likely wouldn't have even thought about cuz you maybe don't even know about them, that where you can use your current skillset and get out of, or step away from actual, you know, treating and still be able to make a great living and, you know, move forward with things and, and be happy. All right. So that's my, my main resource for that.
So, what follows here, I'm gonna give you four steps, four action items for what I think you should do if you are considering stepping away from clinical care, you don't wanna treat anymore, you're thinking that you, you're ready to move away from it.
Number one is start by writing a list of what you don't want. Yes, you can make a list of the things that you want, but if you are currently in a kind of salty place and you're like, I'm fuck this job, like, fuck these patients, I'm done.
That list of things that you want will probably not be as helpful as the list of things that you don't want because again, this is looking to identify the specific things that are causing our unhappiness. Right? So I personally, and this is a list, if you listen to that, that episode from, you know, way back 2020, I spoke about this specifically in the list that I created and what was on my list, right? The list of things that I did not want. The list of things that I did not wanna be doing as part of work and as part of my day-to-day.
Writing this list or this list of itself can buy you more time. Remember I said that this transition is, is likely going to take time.
So as we write out this list, let me look to cross things off that list. This can buy you more time doing what you're doing. Cuz maybe you learn like, actually it's just the environment I'm in. Actually it's just working in these hours or it's primarily working these hours. Or actually maybe it's primarily seeing these cases and I just don't wanna see that.
Like if I could do less pelvic floor and go back to, you know, purely ortho, you might be better off. I might be better off. Right. So that list can absolutely, um, help you buy, buy time. I'm gonna encourage you with this list to get as specific and granular as possible, right? Again, I kind of alluded to it before, is it that you don't like treating certain things, certain people, certain times, in certain ways?
Maybe you don't like that methodology that really that clinic uses. I know that for me that was an issue and I was like, I don't like that approach, and if I leave this clinic, I could buy myself time. That's exactly what I did. I went to multiple clinics and bought myself more time, bought myself more time, and figuring out what I actually wanted to be doing, what I didn't want to be doing as well.
Step number two, get clear on your numbers. I know I've been talking a lot about finances and things like that. It's just, you know, near and dear to my heart, top of mind as well. And as it relates to your career that's the main reason you're still doing your job is probably for the money. So how much money do you need to be making?
What are your expenses? Yes, cutting things can be helpful, but it's not the starting point for me. I want the starting point to be what, uh, what, how much money do you actually need to be making? And then you don't just go and take things away, right? Because like, don't take away your one point of joy, which maybe is like Netflix.
By the way, selling Sunset is back. Haven't watched it yet but it's back. Don't cut out Netflix and save whatever, 11, 19. I don't even know how much it is a month, but like, don't look to save $15 a month meanwhile, you're still seeing shitty patients, right? So you've taken away your joy and you have left a thing that's actually killing you.
This is why point number one was so important. Get, write that list of things that you do not want and look to cross those things off. Second point here, get clear on your numbers. How much money do you need to make? Outline that so that you know next steps, how much do I need to be bringing in? What kind of job do I need be looking for?
Maybe you have savings and you're like, you know what, I wanna rely on those savings for a bit. Either way, how long are those savings gonna take you? You have to know how much you're spending each month, and then we can look to think about cutting back. But realistically, your best bet's always gonna be to look, to bring in more money as opposed to just cut things.
And I don't want you looking to first and foremost just cut out little things, especially if they bring you joy and you haven't addressed or identified and addressed the things that are actually just, you know, killing your soul.
Step number three, audit the rest of your life. Your general health and happiness are paramount and foundational for everything.
So if you're like, yeah, I'm gonna, I think I'm gonna leave clinical care, but is it that like you live in a place that's always dark? I'm thinking about myself in New York City and like the sun was, it was the sun was out, but the buildings were so tall. Winters you have to walk outside. Like it's cold. And also, I don't have a car.
Like I had a car, but you're not driving a car to work. You have to go outside, wait for the train. Everyone's- people are smoking. I was working in the financial district. I was not happy in general. That made it hard to continue treating. When I moved here, uh, moved to California, I was still treating. I, I gradually, I dunno if you heard that little doorbell there.
I gradually phased things out, but I was still treating and I was, I was able to buy myself all of these years, right, where I was still able to bring in money through something I had a tremendous amount of proficiency with because I took away the things that were making me unhappy and I audited the rest of my life and said, Hey, actually living here, living in New York City is not making me happy.
I don't go outside. Right. When I first started as a physical therapist, man, I, I like a year in, I couldn't even run a mile. I went from being a division one athlete, to going to grad school, being a, and I was a, had a multiple gym memberships to, I couldn't even run a mile. I was not in a good way. So audit your life.
Do you go outside? How is your nutrition? Do you move your body? How are your relationships? Look at those and change those things as well. Right? Changing your job's, not gonna change those things. These are foundational. Yes, I know you spend a ton of time at work and that's your, you know, your, your main environment.
But I need you to audit the rest of your life and get those things in order.
And then step number four, very simple: take action. Go back to number one. We made the list of things that you don't like. Now we gotta cross them off. We gotta work, ask, do the things to cross them off. If you listen to that episode that I made, um, one of the first things I did was ask to get my schedule changed.
I went from five eight hour days to four 10 hour days, which was fucking terrible. Let me tell you. It was terrible. But the only way that I could start figuring out what was actually making me unhappy and what would actually make me happy was to start cutting things out and actually changing things. Okay.
I do think that for many of us in the healthcare space, patient care has a shelf life. I think it's twofold here. I think part of it is the inherent structure, right? It's you're seeing a zillion people and you get burned out. We can change that, right? And I think going with this cash-based model is a very viable solution where you get to start treating the people who you want to treat, for the length of time you wanna treat them, in the way that you want to treat them. That can absolutely just turn everything around. Yes, it's gonna bring with the other side, which is actually running the clinic and having all of that responsibility. But if we've identified the things that we actually don't want and we take them away and suddenly we fill in with like, oh, actually, like I love the patients, the patients that I work with. I love my schedule. I love how I get to treat them. This may be the, a very, very viable solution.
I'm thinking about my girl, Karen, and her space that she has set up and the way she does things and life is very, very good for her. But yes, patient care can have its shelf life.
If we're looking for some more resources as it relates to kinda this cash-based solution, number one, Chad Burnham.
I've been talking about him, my guy, he's my recommendation for those of you that maybe have a, that not maybe, he's my recommendation for those of you that have a, uh, insurance-based model right now and you're looking to go cash-based. You wanna switch that. Cuz it is possible and Chad can help you do it.
Danny Matta, I've brought him on a bunch of times. He's my recommendation for those either entering the physical therapy space and looking to start a clinic and you want more of that kind of performance based clinic and you wanna go right into that cash based model. Danny Matta.
Christa Gurka, she's gonna be my third recommendation for those interested in the boutique fitness model.
So again, those three recommendations are all gonna be for brick and mortar in-person, um, models, people that, you're still actually treating people. I think that there's a lot of longevity to be had and there's a lot of solutions there and things that we can change so that we actually enjoy what we're doing and we get to utilize our skillset, right? And yes, it's gonna make sure, it's gonna require that we identify what is it that we actually don't like, and then look to get rid of those things. Right?
The second part of why I think that the patient care may have a shelf life is that it's the sheer gravity of it, right?
It's patient care. It takes a lot. Yes, it's great if we can create, you know, these barriers and energy management and things like that, but like we are being involved with quote unquote, kind of responsible for, tied to, someone else's pain. And that is fucking heavy. And I think that that in and of itself just creates this shelf life, um, for treatment.
All of that to say if you don't wanna treat anymore, it's okay. You're not a bad person. It's not, um, you know, the sunk cost fallacy is exactly that. It's a fallacy. It's not wasted time. It's, you did what you wanted to be doing, needed to be do, needed to be doing, we're great at doing, and now you're ready to do something else.
It's also okay if you have a lot of debt. Like I think that keeps people in there and people are like, I don't know. I know for me in the beginning that kept me in it and I was like, I spent so much money on this degree. I need to do this thing. Not the case at all. Because you'll also probably make more money not as a physical therapist.
So it's okay if, if you do have that debt, you don't, don't, I don't want you to feel beholden to the profession.
I cannot tell you exactly what you should do if you want, if you're thinking about transitioning away from, from patient care. I cannot tell you exactly what next steps will look like. Um, yes, very natural progression for many people is going from B2C, business to consumer, where they're treating, to business to business, where they're teaching other business owners how to treat or how to run their own clinic, things like that.
But honestly, It's, this is individualized and it's up to you. If you want to hear my story, how I switched and, and went through all the different things, again, that's episode 2 31. Um, Courtney will drop that. Um, and again, it took me years to transition away from patient care. It didn't happen overnight. Um, there was many steps along, along the way.
So to me, you know, wrapping this episode up, the super important thing is, is simply taking the time to actually sit with things and think about what you actually do and do not want. Financial safety nets can allow for more of this time. But I know that when you're in it, I'm putting myself back in that position when you're in it and you're just like, fuck, these hours are long, these patients are heavy and it's so much, and you just wanna rid yourself of it. I get that.
Give yourself some time, figure out a way, whether it's you're taking a vacation, which actually was part of what I did as well, I went to California. Give yourself some time to actually sit. And when you're doing that and you're sitting, I suggest you do those four things that I spoke about.
Number one, write a list of the things that you don't want. Number two, get clear on your numbers. Number three, audit your life. And then number four, get started crossing things off of that list, that first list, and making time for the things that you actually do want to fill in.
You got all the re, you got all the references.
I said references. No, no, no. You got all the resources that I listed. Meredith Castin over at The Nonclinical Pt. You got Chad, you got Danny, you got Christa. If you're interested in moving into the online space, you want some guidance with that, that's gonna be the interest list for the program that I'm running with Lex.
All of the things are in this show notes. If you listening to this, are thinking about leaving patient care, please understand, it's okay. You're not a bad person. Nothing is wrong with you. You didn't make the wrong choice. Life is too short to be doing shit that you hate. But it's too long to be making super rash decisions that you then have to go and fix, and you lose time trying to fix those things.
So hopefully this episode give you a good starting point for things, and if you got more questions, shoot me a DM @themovementmaestro. Shoot me a text, 3 1 0 7 3 7 2 3 4 5. Drop me a comment on YouTube and we can chat. As always, endlessly, endlessly, endlessly, endlessly appreciative for every single one of you.
Until next time, friends, Maestro out.
Watch this episode on YouTube!
MOTM #231: My Story
Connect with Anna Hartman: @movementrev
Get on the interest list for mine + Lex’s coaching program
MOTM #314: Education, Disruption, and Product Development with Alyson Evans
Check out The Non-Clinical PT
Connect with Chad: @chad_burnham
Connect with Danny: @dannymattapt
Connect with Christa: @christagurka
Catch me on the socials: Instagram | YouTube | Twitter | TikTok | Facebook